is it ok to lead the playerd in to a scene

[zebaroth]

am writing Doctor who game for my game group
and would like have scene where they go in to see fortune teller
that for shadows what is to come but is it ok to lead players
in to a scene by using the npc Timelord and what to do
they don't go along with it as this impotent to my long term story
arc

[ugavine]

Leading PCs into scenes is what GMing is all about.

what you need to try and do is come up with a sort or multiple choice of options and play ech one out differently whiel still steering them towards your intended plot.

Now, fortelling the future in a RPG can be a dangerous thing because you have really have 3 different sorts of player in these cases;
1) Go with the story. If your players are the sort that play along you won't have a problem. If the Players are playing in the spirit of Doctor Who they should play along.
2) Vs the GM. Give these players an excuse to derail your adventure they will, so telling them the future will only make them try and alter it!
3) Can't take a hint. Sometimes players can miss whats right in front of them and wander in the wrong direction. In a D&D game I've had players spend an hour real time examining a wooden box that was actually... just a wooden box.

So, what to do.

Make the Fortune Telling as vague as possible. A terrible disaster, pain, death!
Do not have the teller say you WILL do THIS, too specific.

It may help with a Time Lord who must try and protect time, you can always penalise him Story Points for blatantly trying to ignore a threat. Other players too for that matter. In-Game the TARDIS Cloister Bell rings sounding impending disaster.

Alternately... the the PCs might not believe the teller, but when they set off they find the TARDIS has been programmed for wherever. Something is jamming the time-cuircuits so they must investigate or just stay where they are (where you want them to be). What was jamming the TARDIS? Maybe nothing, maybe the Time Lords, maybe the TARDIS itself fulfilling its role in events.

Leading characters into a scene is an art, and the real art is doing it without the Players realising it.

[Curufea]

I have to karma that reply - nicely put.

[Craig Oxbrow]

Mar 23, 2010 16:01:27 GMT ugavine said:

Now, fortelling the future in a RPG can be a dangerous thing because you have really have 3 different sorts of player in these cases;
1) Go with the story. If your players are the sort that play along you won't have a problem. If the Players are playing in the spirit of Doctor Who they should play along.
2) Vs the GM. Give these players an excuse to derail your adventure they will, so telling them the future will only make them try and alter it!
3) Can't take a hint. Sometimes players can miss whats right in front of them and wander in the wrong direction. In a D&D game I've had players spend an hour real time examining a wooden box that was actually... just a wooden box.

If you happen to know which of your players is likely to fall into which category, that could be very helpful.

A great piece of advice from SteveD: some things that the characters know about are highly specific, some things extremely vague, so there are multiple possible interpretations that could all influence how the players make their characters react.

The best example of a prophecy I ever came up with was this, from a Buffy game: "And the Watcher's Daughter will fall, yet fight on, and as the sky burns she will hold the fate of the world in her hand..."

The sky burning was definitely going to happen, that was a GM-prerogative special effect. The Watcher's Daughter had to be either the hero PC - or her NPC archenemy. Both readings werre completely valid. Both characters had already died and come back in-game, so that was covered before the prophecy appeared. It didn't occur to the players that it could mean the NPC as well until weeks after they found the prophecy, so it was still surprising. So the only railroading was getting them both to a point where they'd be fighting over the MacGuffin artefact that would decide the final battle. And knowing the hero's player, I knew she'd take the cue to have her run headlong into that, which she duly did.

[mrfinch]

I agree with what Ugavine and craig told you. Game mastering is the art of leading players in action, with no real proof that they not have a choice.
Exemple :
A groupe of player are in town. You have ploting scéne in this town but they want go anywhere out. (Beleve me, it's happen). Don't tell them that is impossible. For one : Why is-it ? The town is open and normal ! Two, the player will fill in cage and maybe will try all the same.
So You may :
- Have a NPC who accuse (Stealing, witchcarfting ...) or kidnapp a Player.
- You may also told that the road at not sure and lead them to the NPC who going crash town.
- Hors OK, the player going out town but the action will happen. They are not there for stop things. It's will be more harder to change the great plan. And like spider man you will tell that they filling greatlly responsible for what happen.
My point it's that important that the player fill that the world's play is bigger than the area where they are. That the action come there or not.

So in your script. One think of what happen last. Then put traces, indices, or area of play form leading them to that last part. But It's will be important that your story is steal possible if the player mist some of them. Or not following a scene. Maybe he will not follow your NPC to Fortune. No matter in a next adventure he may find a another version of Furtune. Older, destroyed ... But with the indice waiting for them (Show up of Face of Boe with a mystery word ; a peace of steel with message, or maybe they have word painting into the place.)

[Corone]

Yup, vague is always best with prophesy,
if they don't quite get it, they can't screw with it.

Leading players can be simple if you give them enough intersting things on the way. The trick is to let them have a lot of small choices ('which door to open first') but leave few options for the big choices (whichever door they pick they'll eventually pick the one you want them to). As long as the place they are in is interesting, they won't worry there is only one way out. They don't walways need choice, but they must have oppotunities to explore.

If your prophesy doesn't come to pass the way you want it to, you can always use that as the next part of the adventure.
So if the sky didn't fall becasue they destroyed the evil machine too early, just have the prophet appear again warning that it wasn't a mistake, there is still more to come. Now you've got a nice link into the next adventure and the start of a campaign arc plot. You can do this as often as you like until the sky does fall as long as you up the stakes each time. The sky falling will eventually become a huge climax.

If you still can't get the players to make it happen you then make it the start of the final adventure "So, guys, you step out of the TARDIS and it looks like the sky is falling." That way you start off the final adventure with the clock ticking.

[Craig Oxbrow]

Mar 24, 2010 9:35:06 GMT mrfinch said:

I agree with what Ugavine and craig told you. Game mastering is the art of leading players in action, with no real proof that they not have a choice.

That's really not what I said...

[mrfinch]

Excuse me, I mesandertand you ! My translation surely !

[azimerthemad]

I've got my players doing my work by imitating the series and doing an upcoming season trailer. At the end of the season premiere, they all read a one sentance description of a scene and one line of dialogue, like "I am standing in front of a smoking machine, cackling, shouting 'This word is going to BURN.;"

Then, if they make that happen, they get 2 story points. So far, its been a big success. They wanted me to do a next episode trailer for every session. Its a pure, simple bribe that works.

[Eternally Lost Zeppo]

Apr 10, 2010 6:05:01 GMT azimerthemad said:

I've got my players doing my work by imitating the series and doing an upcoming season trailer. At the end of the season premiere, they all read a one sentance description of a scene and one line of dialogue, like "I am standing in front of a smoking machine, cackling, shouting 'This word is going to BURN.;"

Then, if they make that happen, they get 2 story points. So far, its been a big success. They wanted me to do a next episode trailer for every session. Its a pure, simple bribe that works.

I've suggested doing this - having got the idea from Primetime Adventures - for my previous Stargate campaign, but the players decided they would rather be surprised at what happens later on. *shrug*

[lunahq7]

^.^

The idea behind leading the players is to do so without the players knowing that they're being led. The invisible leash, so to speak. If you can do that, there's no issue.

And it might be easy to do in Dr. Who, where if you are using him, he is a HUGE expert on most things, or he might decide that your characters going to a fortune-teller might be interesting.

John B.

[korith]

Depending on how the prophecy is being handled, there's also the option of allowing the players to control their own characters in the prophecy. If it's a "window to the future" where a key villain is about to kill The Doctor, for example, any characters present in the future being viewed should be allowed to react as their players decide.

Another possibility is that prophecies aren't always reliable. Sometimes key things change on the way - see The Fires of Pompeii for an example of how prophecies don't always go as expected.

[diebold]

I always call it
"The PLOT TRAIN! WOOO WOO!!!"

pisses off every GM that is forcing the players down a plot path.

Here's what I recommend - have a definite idea where the plot will go, and nudge the players gently in one direction without letting them guess where you are trying to get them to go. That way, if they refuse to go where you tell them to (haha), then you can still slip in the planned result with a few minor changes... and it allows the players to assume that they had a choice in their destiny.

It's worked for me for over 15 years.