Rassilon
Administrator
Grand Administrator
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Post by Rassilon on Oct 23, 2022 21:58:37 GMT
What Did You Think?
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drinkplentyofmalk
2nd Incarnation
Posts: 50
Favourite Doctors: 4, 7, 8. 9, 11 (If I can't just say 'All of them')
Traits: Insatiable Curiosity, Phobia - Thanatosphobia, Slow Reflexes (Minor), Single-Minded (Major)
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Post by drinkplentyofmalk on Oct 24, 2022 1:05:09 GMT
I had fun, wasn't bored and while the plot was messy, it felt like it had gone through enough drafts to be comprehensible - in other words, a complete 180 for this era, and the best Chibnall script since the first two acts of The Power of Three. Plus, it took him about five years, but he finally realized that his ideas are silly and deliberately leaned into that: I expect everyone but me will despise that dance scene, but it was my absolute highlight of the entire era.
The fact the Timeless Child stuff wasn't mentioned outside of a Ruth cameo feels like an admission, as does the fact that the end of this era focused so heavily on nostalgia for old ones that no casual viewer will remember - while the fanwank was absolutely gratuitous, I like that the other actors got a bit of limelight without us being subjected to the millionth multi-Doctor story featuring them this last decade. It IS a bit unfortunate that Jodie spends most of her last and best story as half a dozen other actors, though. (I'll also just brush over the bits that incidentally decanonize aspects of Big Finish, as my brain usually does.)
It was a mess, but I prefer faux-DWM over-the-top lunatic fanwank Chibnall over dull as dishwater fanwank Chibnall. My biggest eye-roll (the obligatory WHAT, WHAT, WHAT) wasn't even his! Oh, and those were probably my favourite last words of any Doctor. If I were to judge it by the standards of all other media (or even most Doctor Who stories), it was a mess with far too much fanwank. If I were judge it by the standards of the last five years? I enjoyed myself, and I'm so so so grateful for that.
THE SHOWRUNNER IS DEAD: LONG LIVE THE SHOWRUNNER!
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misterharry
Dominus Tempus
Dalek Caan's Lovechild
Posts: 3,236
Favourite Doctors: Second, Third, Fourth, Eleventh, Thirteenth
Traits: Empathic, Face in the Crowd, Insatiable Curiosity, Stubborn, Phobia (Heights), Unadventurous
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Post by misterharry on Oct 24, 2022 9:05:46 GMT
Well that was fun! Though I must admit I had my doubts early on with some clunky dialogue and Dan's abrupt departure.
Sasha Dhawan was once again superb as the Master, and I really hope RTD brings him back. Boney M's Rasputin was a laugh-out-loud moment, if a tad self-indulgent. Some great emotion towards the end. And that cliffhanger!
But it was all the little (and not so little) nods to the past that I loved. Ace and Tegan, of course. But also the past Doctors. Nitro-9. Brief mentions of the Brigadier and Adric. Lines of dialogue that called back to old episodes - Croydon! The Doctor's recorder. Jo Martin. Graham Sinclair - great to see Bradley again! Companions Anonymous - doesn't William Russell look good for a 97 year old!
A joy to watch.
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Post by soultaker666212 on Oct 24, 2022 15:39:41 GMT
I will be honest I did really enjoy this one. It did feel messy in some places and wish we had more explanation on some of the stuff to be honest such as that weird alien power source thingy I forgot its name now and a few other stuffs. However, I did it quite a lot better than what I thought I would get out of it not going to lie. I am one of those in the boat who enjoyed the Rasputin dance scene did find it cringy but hilarious especially the dalek and cyberman looking at each other in confusion. Ace and Tegan were amazing this and glad to see their return, even seeing the others like Jo and Mel and Ian at the end made me smile. I loved the classic doctor's bit though that was truly heartwarming even with Paul McGann being there did make me react with joy.
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Post by markrand on Oct 24, 2022 15:49:39 GMT
I recorded it off BBC America last night and am watching it now. So far, I love it.
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awfullotofrunning
2nd Incarnation
Posts: 19
Favourite Doctors: Christopher Eccleston and David Tennant
Traits: Boffin
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Post by awfullotofrunning on Oct 24, 2022 16:03:55 GMT
David Tennant is the fourteeth doctor what the actual fuck
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Post by markrand on Oct 24, 2022 18:38:22 GMT
Good episode with an unusual ending.
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awfullotofrunning
2nd Incarnation
Posts: 19
Favourite Doctors: Christopher Eccleston and David Tennant
Traits: Boffin
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Post by awfullotofrunning on Oct 24, 2022 20:28:41 GMT
Okay I think I'm now in a position to give my full thoughts. Okay so going into this I've already have some... concerns regarding the quality of the episode. The Chibnall era has already bungled so many aspects that are synonymous with the show and plot arcs that its hard to go in expecting any guaranteed quality. Even Thasmin was just kinda thrown in at the end of the era and just not... given a proper chance. So let's talk about this, the regeneration episode.
Okay so let's start with the cold open shall we? Its overall pretty weak. It doesn't take its time with establishing the scene and what team TARDIS are even doing there to begin with. But then again, there's already cybermen on the scene so I suppose we don't need to suspend our disbelief too much here, same thing for why the hole in Dan's helmet and immediately cause him to start suffocating but at the very least get a little hint that he's thinking of leaving when he stops to stare at the crack and that's at least a nice piece of foreshadowing.
But here's the thing, the fact Dan is even considering leaving comes right out of left field and while its arguably less forced than Yaz's departure it still feels forced and that's just... upsetting. Dan as a character was of to a great start when he debuted but since the original plans for series 13 were scrapped over the pandemic and flux was hastily draw up to replace it we're never going to see his full development as it was originally intended.
Okay so Sasha Diwan's master has managed to somehow evade death AGAIN and has taken the guise of Rasputin. Now Diwan really comes into his own in this episode as the master, wonderfully suave and maniacal in his acting and just sells the character. His best performance as The Master yet! The scene where he dances to Boney M.'s Rasputin will forever be a highlight of the era for me just because that level of showmanship is so in character (and yes, I am listening to that song while writing this why do you ask?) Even if the plot feels convoluted with the master basically doing the exact same thing in two different eras and somehow not causing some time-wimey shenanigans while simultaneously fusing with the doctor to ruin their image (the latter plot point was horribly glossed over and maybe could be explored a little more) but despite that it still gets on as a great master centric story.
Ace and Tegan on the other hand? Well I'm going to be blunt, they felt like bloat. They don't serve much purpose in the story besides fan-service, like they could have easily been swapped out for any other companion and the result would be the same. As a matter of fact I would go as far as to say their roles should've been filled by Dan and Graham respectively, it would have given both a serendipitous sendoff which Dan in particular desperately needed. In fact I would say this applies also to Rishad, Vinder, The 1st, 5th, 6th, 7th, and 8th Incarnations of the doctor. The first, 6th and 8th doctors in particular because none of the returning characters are from media staring them, its just a weird to think just how much has been shoehorned into this episode. I could almost swear Chibnal was so stuck for ideas he just had a dartboard of characters from the franchise and just added in whatever he threw a dart at. Its just... a mess.
And then there's the pacing because ho boy, if you thought Flux was awkwardly paced, this is just a whole lot worse. Like even with the extended runtime the plot moves just way to fast for my liking. Even in what are supposed to be slower moments you just don't get that room to digest the plot. A story of this scope really should benefit from a slower burn. Because you have more time to fill, you can take your time. Make sure each scene gets the time it needs to hit the way it does. (Kinda of an awrkward wording but I hope it gets the point across.) But no, it keeps going at this breakneck pace and breaks its neck because of the pace its going at. A good example is when the Master Doctor drags Yaz into the TARDIS and proceeds to attempt to ruin the doctor's image, after the master gets a change of clothes it just jumps ahead to the to planets destroying each other instead of showing us how he does it.
And finally we come to the ending. Now its not perfect, but it very well makes a damn good effort to stick the landing. To be honest when the promos promised a "Reichenbach Falls" climax I was expecting the doctor and the master to mutually attempt to kill each other before leading into the regeneration because well yeah, a protagonist and an antagonist who are effectively immortal may feel like an undercutting of a climax like that you can still make it work; and well I felt like that wasn't what I got. Regardless it was genuinely hard warming to watch the 13th doctor and Yaz spending their last moments together before Yaz inexplicably left the TARDIS (little weird but hey I guess we've got to make room for Donna Noble SOMEHOW) and watching that glorious regeneration shot superimposed onto the newly formed "Companions Anonymous" just brought it home.
And then. Holy roly-poly! Bam! David Tennant! DAVID TENNANT! DAVID FUCKING TENNANT! What a twist! I am crossing my fingers for a good payoff for this because man, I want to know, I want to know what the heck is causing a repeat regeneration. (Also what caused the doctor's clothes to also pull off a first and regenerate with him instead of staying on him and you just have a newly regenerated incarnation in ill-fitting clothes.) And here's hoping we get one!
Overall, while Power of The Doctor had problems, it still had its great moments. No sure where it'll fit into my tierlist, if I ever make one, of 13th doctor stories but here's to a bright new era of who!
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Catsmate
13th Incarnation
No longer living in a bad adaption of "A Journal of the Plague Year".
Posts: 3,730
Favourite Doctors: Thirteen, Six, Five, Two, Eight, Twelve, Nine, One, Eleven..
Traits: Eccentric, Insatiable Curiousity.
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Post by Catsmate on Oct 25, 2022 11:50:06 GMT
Mediocre. Two many plot ideas and too much fanservice at the cost of plot, characterisation and dialogue.
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Post by Escher on Oct 25, 2022 11:53:47 GMT
David Tennant is the fourteeth doctor what the actual feck
From The Day Of The Doctor
The Doctor (Matt Smith) "I never forget a face" The Curator (Tom Baker) "I know you don't. and in years to come, you might find yourself revisiting a few. But just the old favorites, eh?" . . .
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awfullotofrunning
2nd Incarnation
Posts: 19
Favourite Doctors: Christopher Eccleston and David Tennant
Traits: Boffin
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Post by awfullotofrunning on Oct 25, 2022 12:50:18 GMT
David Tennant is the fourteeth doctor what the actual feck
From The Day Of The Doctor
The Doctor (Matt Smith) "I never forget a face" The Curator (Tom Baker) "I know you don't. and in years to come, you might find yourself revisiting a few. But just the old favorites, eh?" ... I am well aware of that line. And it does intrugue me. Like is doctor who coming to an end? Was Nucti Gatwa a troll reveal?
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drinkplentyofmalk
2nd Incarnation
Posts: 50
Favourite Doctors: 4, 7, 8. 9, 11 (If I can't just say 'All of them')
Traits: Insatiable Curiosity, Phobia - Thanatosphobia, Slow Reflexes (Minor), Single-Minded (Major)
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Post by drinkplentyofmalk on Oct 25, 2022 17:24:24 GMT
Mediocre. Two many plot ideas and too much fanservice at the cost of plot, characterisation and dialogue. I can't disagree, but practically everything in this era (post Series 11) has focused around fan-service, recycled Russell ideas and reveals baked in 80s fanbrain that only really matter because they affect prior eras of the show by proxy - this was just the natural ending to the sheer apathy this era had in itself.
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Post by grinch on Oct 25, 2022 20:26:43 GMT
Mediocre. Two many plot ideas and too much fanservice at the cost of plot, characterisation and dialogue. To be honest, I share your sentiments. Even for an anniversary special I found it a trifle self indulgent. Not to mention, it contained all the hallmarks of a theory I have about modern television. That a lot of scenes are written first to be shared as clips/memes on Twitter and the like rather than actually serving the story. The Rasputin Dance scene springs to mind. But now I’m just shouting into the wind.
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stahlman
3rd Incarnation
Doctor, stop wasting my time, will you?
Posts: 222
Favourite Doctors: second,third,fourth
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Post by stahlman on Oct 26, 2022 13:31:02 GMT
It was of a consistent quality with the rest of Chibnall's era.
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Catsmate
13th Incarnation
No longer living in a bad adaption of "A Journal of the Plague Year".
Posts: 3,730
Favourite Doctors: Thirteen, Six, Five, Two, Eight, Twelve, Nine, One, Eleven..
Traits: Eccentric, Insatiable Curiousity.
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Post by Catsmate on Oct 26, 2022 13:38:33 GMT
It was of a consistent quality with the rest of Chibnall's era. Damned with faint praise.
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Post by imajica on Mar 13, 2023 15:41:01 GMT
Finally got around to watching this last night. Got to say I was happy with it. I mean, yes, it's Chibnall but it wasn't the incomprehensible idea soup of the entire last series. It actually felt like it had a beginning, middle, and end. It was self-indulgent, yes, but no worse than David Tennant moping around saying goodbye to everyone. The ploty sort of made sense, and there were a few funny moments. Just a shame the rest of his era has been of so low a quality that this stands out as a decent episode. JW has had the send-off she needed, and RTD can get on with things. The Master was excellent, an improvement on his previous outings. My only real complaint is that my year 7 students could do a better job photoshopping a face into a famous painting than they had there.
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